Qiblah direction

[emarouf]

Originally Posted by Hanif

Assalamu Alaykum

I just wanted to ask for those who live in North America which direction do you pray for the qiblah? The reason I ask this is because I saw this guy for the 2nd time praying in the opposite direction than the way we always been praying. We pray towards the North eastish. So I had to ask him why he was doing that. Never met him before. He told me that qiblah is south east and said he knows he checked the map shows south east. He said reason people pray North east is from calculation. I was thinking maybe we pray to the north because its the closest direction to the qiblah as the earth is round. Im pretty sure he was looking at a flat map but i didnt want to answer or discuss with him that i didnt know too much about or what the answer exactly is. So I ask what is the direction and why? What i mean by why is that is it by calculation or map or what? Its just for me to gain knowledge instead of blind following and maybe convince him the next time i see him.

Jazakallahu Khair

From what I know North east is the shortest distance to the qibla looking at the shape of the globe.

Obviously if you look on a flat map then south east looks like the only way.

Allah knows best...

[Hallie]

Originally Posted by Hanif

Assalamu Alaykum

I just wanted to ask for those who live in North America which direction do you pray for the qiblah? The reason I ask this is because I saw this guy for the 2nd time praying in the opposite direction than the way we always been praying. We pray towards the North eastish. So I had to ask him why he was doing that. Never met him before. He told me that qiblah is south east and said he knows he checked the map shows south east. He said reason people pray North east is from calculation. I was thinking maybe we pray to the north because its the closest direction to the qiblah as the earth is round. Im pretty sure he was looking at a flat map but i didnt want to answer or discuss with him that i didnt know too much about or what the answer exactly is. So I ask what is the direction and why? What i mean by why is that is it by calculation or map or what? Its just for me to gain knowledge instead of blind following and maybe convince him the next time i see him.

Jazakallahu Khair

you've also gotta remember that maps are distorted...

everything i've ever seen on it is that its NE-ish

[iss ME! zahweee!]

unfortunately this is not a new debate in north america
there are plenty of people who forget the world is not flat and only consult flat maps [we should look at the world as it is to determine what "makes sense"]

google "qibla direction" and you'll get the full info from a muslim scientist at moonsighting - including a nice picture of a globe which shows you it makes no sense to pray southwest

[edit: just added the pic, but still go to the site for more info]

[Nihalk1]

Ws,

I recently found out that there are some scholars who truly believe that the qiblah in North America should be southeast and not northeast.

They were of the opinion that the Qiblah is the direction of the Ka'bah, not the shortest distance to it.

Ofcourse this just their opinions from personal insight and evaluation, they still maintain it fine to pray northeast because the whole Jama'ah of America is praying northeast.

I know of some masajid in NA that pray directly east. (For you New Yorkers, the qiblah in JMC is directly East from what I've heard.)

[Sabhi]

Scienctific studies have shown that the earth is not round. "The shape of the Earth is very close to that of an oblate spheroid, a sphere squished along the orientation from pole to pole such that there is a bulge around the equator.[50]". Studies have also shown that there are edges in the earth, one in Peru, South of Africa, and near New Guinea.
this is according to thw Wikipedia. Accourding what the people who face Northeast, they say this is the shortest distance, thats if the earth was a perfect sphere, but with the earth being an oblate spheroid, it would be longer to go North from North America and reaching the North Pole and then going South of the North Pole towards Mecca. But this doesnt matter, none of the muslim scholars mentioned that the qiblah is the shortest distance to mecca nor did the ijma^ al muslimin. Moreover, the Ijma^ Al Muslimin ruled that the qiblah in North America is Southeast. A fatwa was also made in Al Azhar that the qiblah in North America is actually Southeast. Proof of that the Ijma^ said this are the old mosques that were built in North America, they're all pointing towards South East. There is also cemeteries in which the Muslimin were buirried facing Southeast. Think of this, If there was a 100 story building and you wanted to get to the other side, would you go up and over it and then go down or would you go around it, which would be closer? Going around it would be closer! But when it comes to the rulongs of scholars of Islam, not I nor you decide which way is the qiblah due to scientfic studies or personal opinions. Imam Ali said in a meaning if the deen was by opinion, people would have wiped the khouf from the bottom of the foot, a person might think this because he walks all day on the bottom of his foot, not the top, but the deen is not by studies and opinions so we turn around to scholars who learned from scholars who learned from the Prophet pbuh. Here are some proof of what the Ijma^ Al Muslimin ruled. May Allah make this helpful to you and others.

[Abdul Razzaq]

Originally Posted by Sabhi

North america is in the Northern part of the earth, it is abouve the Equator. Mecca, however, is below the Equator which makes it in the Southern part of the earth.

I'm pretty sure Mecca is in the northern hemisphere. according to google earth 21*25'.21.00" N 39*49'34.00 E

[Sabhi]

@ Abdul Razzaq, it is known by all muslims from the time of Prophet Adam pbuh to our time that the Kaaba is in the center of the earth, not south nor north and this cannot be denied. First, let me set things straight, if I were directly on the other side of the world from the Kaaba, the shortest distance, according to the people who pray northeast, would be for me to pray towards the floor. So I would lay down on the floor and pray if the shortest distance was the case. But it is mentioned in the Quran
وَمِنْ حَيْثُ خَرَجْتَ فَوَلِّ وَجْهَكَ شَطْرَ الْمَسْجِدِ الْحَرَامِ وَحَيْثُ مَا كُنتُمْ فَوَلُّواْ وُجُوهَكُمْ شَطْرَهُ
So this aya states that the person must "face" Masjid Al Haram. What does face mean? It does not mean the shortest distance as if we were traveling to mecca. Now, back to what I was saying that the Kaaba is in the center of the earth, if the qibla was the north and north america is north of the Kaaba than Imam Abu Hanifa would not have said"the people of the north pray to the south and the people of the south pray to the north and the people of the east pray to the west and the people of the west pray to the east" and north america is north of al Kaaba and no doubt about that!!!
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[Yusuf513Khan]

Originally Posted by Nihalk1

They were of the opinion that the Qiblah is the direction of the Ka'bah, not the shortest distance to it.

Doesn't the direction of the Ka'bah necessitate that it be the shortest distance?

I remember reading on the net long time ago about Sh. bin Bayyah coming to Canada and praying a different direction in Canada and mentioned due to the direction of the stars. (this could be a completely fabricated story since it was from the net + my memory).

[peaceman]

Salam alaikum wrb,

The issue of the correct direction of qiblah in North America should be presented
to a shura of scholars, and they can give a ruling on what is the correct direction.
It is not appropriate to go by individual judgements, as that would not be following
on the footsteps of the salaf. It is not befitting to interject personal judgements and
belittle the noble knowledge of our predecessor ulema going back to prophet Muhammed, may Allah's peace and blessing be upon him.